Bolt ons or straight turbo?

[Young Roids]

Well I have this crazy idea that instead of doing the usual bolt ons for the ms3 what if you went right for a turbo insted? Cost wise if you do the DP, MP, SRI and FMIC it will put you right at about $1800 give or take so would it be a better idea to just go for a better turbo for that money say the dual ballbearing gt3071r or maybe just a gt2871r?

 

[dmention7]

I'm not too up on the modding path for the MS3, but it strikes me that going straight for a bigger turbo without supporting mods would be a poor idea. At the very least, I personally would want a full exhaust and FMIC in place before going big turbo.

 

[AJ]

If you don't have something to tune with there is no point and you'll do more hard then good.

 

[Jesse MS3GT]

If the exhaust doesnt flow freely enough your larger turbo wont spool until late = shitty power band. Helping the engine breathe easier helps with that, too.

Oh and if you go big turbo you better have an upgraded CDFP first. More boost/air without more fuel = kaBOOM!!11

 

[shadyspeed3]

unless your gonna go all out and build everything there is no need for a bigger turbo. i have the mods that you listed and the price is about what you mentioned. the turbo on our cars can more than handle more boost. a few nights ago i did a slow pull from 5th gear and my boost gauge kept going and going. i peaked at almost 20 lbs and i had to let off b/c i was going way too fast. so unless your looking to run 25-30 lbs and some ungodly ammount of hp and doing a full build a bigger turbo is not necessary. yet

 

[Jesse MS3GT]

Do you have the catted dp?

 

[mazdamn02]

I rather like the K04 turbo that's stock on the MS3 because it spools up so quick. If only it didn't run out of steam in the 5k rpm range...

 

[Young Roids]

A tuning solution might need to be added. But my line of logic is that the stock exhaust might flow pretty well stock. My hp goal for when I begin modding is gonna be 300whp so I am wondering the best route to get there. The k04 spools good but if you got a slightly bigger garret ballbearing turbo it could give you quik spool and not run out at the top.

 

[shadyspeed3]

Nope

 

[shadyspeed3]

for anyone that has a down pipe and cat delete on there car you will learn how restricted the downpipe actually is. right where it turns down it squeezes down to a tiny opening into the cat right off the turbo. tbe on our cars makes into a new beast!!!! boltons ftw! :66:

 

[Young Roids]

See no one has done this yet so how does everyone know for a fact that it won't work?

 

[Picklz]

Alright first without a solid tuning solution, shooting for a solid 300whp doesn't sound like a good idea to me. If 300whp is as far as you want to take the car, I suspect the stock turbo is going to be alright based on the compressor maps that have been published. Much beyond that and I think an upgrade is going to be needed.

Now just because our little turbo can push 20+ PSI of boost doesn't mean it's doing it efficiently, especially at high RPM's. Doing something once, or even for 6 months is a lot different than building something that is going to be reliable for years of use.

Fuel and Tuning would be my primary concerns right now, If I were shooting for big power a wideband would probably be one of my first mods.

Just throwing a bigger turbo on MAY get you where you want to go, but it's not the method I would suggest. I'm still of the opinion that until the ECU on this car is figured out you would be better served saving your money. Let others figure out what works and what doesnt, then buy a proven solution to get you where you want to be.

Just watching that boost gauge climb to a higher PSI isn't everything.

 

[Young Roids]

I agree about getting a tuning solution working before really modding the car. But the reason that I am thinking someone should try switching out the turbo is because cobb claims that the turbo is the reason for the loss of topend.

 

[Picklz]

I guess from the maps I've seen that shouldn't be the case, but, It is possible. My theory was either mazda was worried about fuel issues with high boost beyond 5800rpm or they wanted to keep the power in-check for reliablity/saftey issues, but maybe the turbo is getting too far out of its efficiency range to reliably push boost at that RPM.

 

[spek1098]

Yea, the guys that are running bigger turbos are gimping the ecu to lay down the bigger numbers. If your not concerned with damaging the engine (planing on building it one day?) then go ahead with the bigger turbo, but as said, no point if you don't have the supporting mods and haven't max'd the stock turbo out yet.

 

[Young Roids]

I am just speculating since I don't plan on modding at all before my warranty expires. I don't want to build a whole engine though I want to just get to 300 at the wheels and quit.

 

[1fastmsp]

i say slap a GT42R on there and boost the hell out of it, but go find a good race first because it will be your first and last race lol but no really, if i were you, i would strat with bolt ons like Shadyspeed3 did, shit he made 270hp with exhaust, BOV and FMIC. I'd say thats a pretty damn good start.

 

[dmention7]

See no one has done this yet so how does everyone know for a fact that it won't work?

The thing is, unless you've got a spare motor laying around, you probably don't want to be the first one to try slapping a bigger turbo on there without supporting mods or tuning.... lol

Then again, if you don't plan on modding until your warranty is up, by that point I'm sure more people will have gotten more creative with their modding, and there will be a big more of a general consensus on the proper way to do things.

 

[shadyspeed3]

Just watching that boost gauge climb to a higher PSI isn't everything.

the thing is i was trying to say is our turbos can put out a lot more that what is set at factory. i do not have a boost controller or any tuning at the moment and i am able to boost significantly more just from freeing up the flow of the intake and exhaust. straping a bigger turbo to such a restrictive intake, leaky bpv and exhaust would be pointless imo. yesa bigger turbo is going to be more efficent on the top end but you not going to build boost untill a lot later.

as far as fuel, if i wasnt so busy id put up my pics and dyno sheet and show you fuel is not a problem(well mine is not, i suppose it might differ car to car)
on the top end of my dyno i was so pig rich!

but if it is what you want to do and dont fear the the problems that may come with the bigger turbo, then i say go for it. any modding comes with the possibilities of the own problems and we all take that risk for more hp/tq! they say our turbo's blow seals with downpipes or tbe's and there are cars out there blowing them. i havent (knock on wood!!) yet but it is a risk i took.

:woohoo1: go for it!

 

[shadyspeed3]

also a stock motor at about 19lbs our car gets a boost cut and they dont like it! anyone know of a way to limit the boost to be lower? i actually want to turn mine back down to a safer level, no more than 17-18!