COBBLE COBBLE?

[Young Roids]

I am going to quote what I found on mazdaspeed forums. Jesse might be able to fill us in further since he mods over there.


Quote from Josh!
"The peak power numbers for these graphs are as follows:
Stock = 247 ft. lb. TQ / 212 WHP
Stage1 + SF = 267 ft. lb. TQ / 222 WHP (20 WTQ, +10WHP)
Stage2 + SF Intake = 279 ft. lb. TQ / 232 WHPâ€￾ (32WTQ, +20 WHP)"

 

[Young Roids]

So aparently the AP loses 1hp in stage 1 mode since the short ram intake nets 11hp without the ap. People are gonna be pissed off in a major way about this. All the waiting, all the pre orders for this?

So now it looks like the best thing for the MS3 seems to be just to throw the bolt-ons in there with no tuning software.

 

[dmention7]

Do you have a bigger version of that dyno chart? The peak numbers are a bit disappointing, but I'd have to see the curves to make any real judgement.

The most surprising thing to me is that peak power is showing such measly gains.... I was anticipating decent gains in peak power due to the AP allowing the car to hold boost higher into the rev range, but from those numbers it sounds like the car is getting a modest bump in mid-range torque but still falling on its face by 5500-6000rpms.

 

[mazdamn02]

I saw these numbers, my analysis is cobb ap = no big deal.

I'm pretty sure that with a tbe and cai you'd get 32WTQ, +20 WHP.

Time to depart the cobb train, lol.

 

[dmention7]

What I'd be really interested to see is how the AP allows you to respond to more aggressive mods like an upgraded fuel pump and increased boost.

 

[mndsm]

Yeah, once that all happens, then we shall see. Cobble Cobble indeed.

 

[Workdawg]

One thing that is mentioned a lot in the cobb thread on M3F is that that dyno is on an AWD dyno, and it's at a higher altitude. They are supposed to be getting new dyno charts from one of their tuners at sea-level, and on a FWD dyno.

“This dyno graph has been generated on our AWD Chassis dyno while running the car in AWD mode"

The front wheels have to spin both drums, which I can see hurting the results quite a bit.

 

[dmention7]

If their baseline was done on the same dyno though, it really shouldn't matter too much.

 

[Workdawg]

That's a good point Jay. The guy from Cobb made a big deal about those being "initial results". I'm sure we'll see a lot more dynos in the next few days.

 

[mazdamn02]

If their baseline was done on the same dyno though, it really shouldn't matter too much.

Exactly. Why would it loose power with their intake? LOL. ickle:

 

[mndsm]

Cause Hondas do it.

 

[cosmicspd3]

this is why you let the product sit on the market for a bit before you buy it, see how it pans out. i think once its in tuners hands it could be making osme sweet numbers

 

[Slim]

Maybe I'm a noob, but what's Stage 1 + SF vs. Stage 1 + SF Intake?

And I'm with Josh so far. TBE + SRI/CAI should easily net similar gains.

 

[Young Roids]

I think that they are both just equiped with the intake and it is just worded funny.

Why doesn't it make power after 6k? I thought that was one of the main things this AP was supposed to do was have throttle plate control. This car has plenty of low end torque the last thing we need is more torque lower down. We need top end.

Now it looks like we should be giving the piasani flash a second look that one actually makes power.

 

[dmention7]

Why doesn't it make power after 6k? I thought that was one of the main things this AP was supposed to do was have throttle plate control. This car has plenty of low end torque the last thing we need is more torque lower down. We need top end.

My thoughts exactly.

 

[mazdamn02]

I hear that if you put a few of these on the MAF assembly you get +100 hp:

 

[Young Roids]

Josh, it feels like it's time to retire the old Will Ferrel AP sig.:rip: As it seems the AP will not cure the fever after all.

 

[spek1098]

“This dyno graph has been generated on our AWD Chassis dyno while running the car in AWD mode. We must do this so the traction control system does not take over and re-tune the car. We have spent extensive time trying to smooth out the throttle control, boost control, and torque control systems so this car is more enjoyable to drive. This makes the car easier to drive at part throttle conditions, allows for much smoother part throttle control, and the vehicle acts less like an on/off switch. By doing this we have significantly increased the gas mileage of the vehicle as well with our Stage1 and Stage2 calibrations.

The peak power numbers for these graphs are as follows:
Stock = 247 ft. lb. TQ / 212 WHP
Stage1 + SF = 267 ft. lb. TQ / 222 WHP (20 WTQ, +10WHP)
Stage2 + SF Intake = 279 ft. lb. TQ / 232 WHP” (32WTQ, +20 WHP)

(Let me know if this pic doesn't work, it's blocked here at work)

compare the SRI dyno to the SRI + AP dyno:

Below is a dyno graph from our initial Stage1 calibration with a AFR trace

 

[spek1098]

Why doesn't it make power after 6k? I thought that was one of the main things this AP was supposed to do was have throttle plate control. This car has plenty of low end torque the last thing we need is more torque lower down. We need top end.

If you go through and read Josh @ Cobb's post they get into this issue quite a bit. I think they have concluded that it is not because of the throttle plate closing, but simple that the turbo runs out of air. PT-P has some good examples of just how small the exhaust side is on this turbo.

Josh @ Cobbs post on M3F

omg stock turbo sucks!

 

[Jesse MS3GT]

As Laloosh stated on MSF. Low end torque + our weak rods = very possible breakage. Even without the ap I dont like loading the engine too much at low rpm.